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acidfluxxbass
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United Kingdom
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 Posted - 2011/03/19 : 21:27:55
Today French, UK and US forces launched air strikes against strategic locations in Libya.
Presently Spain are making refuelling 707's and bases available to the coalition, and launched 4 more F-18 birds.
This stuffs getting heavy. What do you all make of it?
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TheOneNOnly
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Posted - 2011/03/19 : 21:59:09
What do I think about it?
'Bout damn time.
Did they have to wait for a certain quota of dead innocents from Pro-Government before going in? Or was the Colonel still promising them oil for them not to do anything?
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The Dopeman
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Posted - 2011/03/19 : 22:06:26
from what i've heard those countries that are against the no fly zone will get oil those wh are not won't get any oil in the future but this shuda happened last week they've left it a bit l8
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whispering
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Finland
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Posted - 2011/03/19 : 22:50:53
quote:
Originally posted by TheOneNOnly:
What do I think about it?
'Bout damn time.
Did they have to wait for a certain quota of dead innocents from Pro-Government before going in? Or was the Colonel still promising them oil for them not to do anything?
They waited for bureaucracy, in cases of war and military strikes its a good thing IMHO. I think the whole thing was played pretty well. It has the worlds "approval", some didnt like it, but accepted it.
Last time it was more like that: http://satwcomic.com/the-day-the-iraq-war-started
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latininxtc
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United States
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Posted - 2011/03/19 : 23:43:43
quote:
Originally posted by whispering:
quote:
Originally posted by TheOneNOnly:
What do I think about it?
'Bout damn time.
Did they have to wait for a certain quota of dead innocents from Pro-Government before going in? Or was the Colonel still promising them oil for them not to do anything?
They waited for bureaucracy, in cases of war and military strikes its a good thing IMHO. I think the whole thing was played pretty well. It has the worlds "approval", some didnt like it, but accepted it.
Last time it was more like that: http://satwcomic.com/the-day-the-iraq-war-started
i agree this decision for the US was well thought out, unlike Iraq where our decision was fueled by the distraught of 9/11. and this isn't a decision that just benefits ourselves, it benefits the area as a whole that this dictator is overthrown
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acidfluxxbass
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Posted - 2011/03/19 : 23:48:52
Yes, Obama and the UN were careful to engage only when completely necessary. I agree we should have entered.
But we wnter Libya, where we ignore killings in Tibet, Syria, Bahrain, Yemen and so on.
Ultimatums and false ceasefires made this justified. Any supporters of Gaddafi must acknowledge the lies that the government spout.
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whispering
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Posted - 2011/03/20 : 00:00:32
quote:
Originally posted by acidfluxxbass:
But we wnter Libya, where we ignore killings in Tibet, Syria, Bahrain, Yemen and so on.
The difference is that Libyans revolted, like not just a handful, but most people. I think in the modern world traditional revolutions are harder to do. The opposition in this case used mercenaries from other countries and excessive military equipment, which common folk just cant fight against. The others you mentioned revolted but not in such high numbers. And Tibet is impossible, even if China went bat shit insane with the area.
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Warnman
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Germany
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Posted - 2011/03/20 : 14:06:59
I think the effects of sending air force to Lybia are being overrated. No war ever has been won by owning sovereignty over the airspace only. Remember Vietnam!
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jenks
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United Kingdom
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Posted - 2011/03/21 : 08:04:31
It's not a war, it's a humanitarian effort. The UN mandate doesn't allow for anything beyond protecting civilians. If Gadaffi is toppled, it'll be because the air strikes allow the rebels to take him down.
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tru bass
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Posted - 2011/03/21 : 11:09:00
quote:
Originally posted by jenks:
It's not a war, it's a humanitarian effort. The UN mandate doesn't allow for anything beyond protecting civilians. If Gadaffi is toppled, it'll be because the air strikes allow the rebels to take him down.
Spot on.
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NekoShuffle
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Posted - 2011/03/21 : 11:55:40
Morally I dunno where I stand on this, on the one hand I'm totally against war and fighting and so on, on the other hand he is going to massacre his people if we let this go on :/ Trouble is, if he was to suddenly declare that he is embracing democracy I don't know if I would trust him.
Hopefully gadaffi is toppled with minimal bombs dropped and casualties. I do think he is fighting a losing battle though, even the middle east aren't supporting him. If he retaliates to europe then we'll fight back so heavy handedly along with america who will no doubt get involved we'll probably end up raising Libiya to the ground..
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Triquatra
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Posted - 2011/03/21 : 12:22:54
mmm, tricky issues like this are why we have people in power to make the tough choices!
in this case i think they've made the right choice, but they took too long to do it.
I also think the media are eating their words, the BBC bummed the situation as much as they could when it arose with a constant stream of how the entire country wanted regime change and that it was another glorious uprising and the only ones who wanted him to stay in power were hired helps from other countries...now they are barely showing the rebels, and its a constant stream of green flags and people kissing photos of gadaffi...
nobody really wants to confront what happens if he keeps control...or at least regains control for long enough that it becomes a very very real humanitarian issue.
after all...res 1973 does give "all necessary measures"
duh duh dahhhhhhhhh
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Dante
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Vatican City State (Holy See)
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Posted - 2011/03/21 : 12:52:10
Not many Libyans here in Norway, but they sure don't like Kadhafi, posing with the old Libyan flag etc, saying he's worse than Hitler:
http://www.dagbladet.no/2011/03/18/nyheter/libya/utenriks/muammar_kadhafi/politikk/15870489/
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TheOneNOnly
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Posted - 2011/03/21 : 14:51:51
quote:
Originally posted by jenks:
It's not a war, it's a humanitarian effort. The UN mandate doesn't allow for anything beyond protecting civilians. If Gadaffi is toppled, it'll be because the air strikes allow the rebels to take him down.
If you want to get technical, the United States hasn't been in a war since World War II. Does that make it any less real what we're doing? No. If the UN decides to bomb Gadaffi's forces, there is still a very high chance they'll kill civilians in the process.
quote:
Originally posted by NekoShuffle: Trouble is, if he was to suddenly declare that he is embracing democracy I don't know if I would trust him.
According to good ol' Gadaffi his people are revolting because of Al Queda and drugs. Do you really think you could trust him from the beginning?
quote:
Originally posted by DjTriquatra:
I also think the media are eating their words, the BBC bummed the situation as much as they could when it arose with a constant stream of how the entire country wanted regime change and that it was another glorious uprising and the only ones who wanted him to stay in power were hired helps from other countries...now they are barely showing the rebels, and its a constant stream of green flags and people kissing photos of gadaffi...
Isn't that always the case though? The media just wants to show what they think will give them more ratings, more viewings. They talked non-stop about the rebels, now they're going the opposite to try to bring people back in. People losing lives? They don't give a shit, they already reported about it before, show something else! If they had had the chance they would of done the same thing with Egypt, but the military chose the middle ground route so they couldn't.
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NekoShuffle
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Posted - 2011/03/21 : 15:52:46
quote:
Originally posted by TheOneNOnly:
quote:
Originally posted by NekoShuffle: Trouble is, if he was to suddenly declare that he is embracing democracy I don't know if I would trust him.
No not at all, my point is that I'm scared that he will "change" and the UN will be like "Oh he's promised to be good now, lets take his word for it" while his people are slaughtered like cattle :|
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Triquatra
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Posted - 2011/03/21 : 16:29:22
oh i agree, its always the case liley, i just like pointing out that the bbc arent an exception ;)
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